Comments on: Opportunity Actions: Campaign Workshop – Betrayal http://www.rpgmusings.com/2010/06/opportunity-actions-campaign-workshop-betrayal/ Play The Game You Want To Play Tue, 31 Jan 2012 00:39:36 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: The Opportunist http://www.rpgmusings.com/2010/06/opportunity-actions-campaign-workshop-betrayal/comment-page-1/#comment-189 The Opportunist Tue, 22 Jun 2010 17:49:29 +0000 http://www.rpgmusings.com/?p=598#comment-189 Good points here. I didn't write it in the posting, but I'd be totally transparent with my players about this from the word go. This is a very different style of play, and I'm offering it up to get us thinking about making this sort of thing work. Good points here. I didn’t write it in the posting, but I’d be totally transparent with my players about this from the word go.
This is a very different style of play, and I’m offering it up to get us thinking about making this sort of thing work.

]]> By: Gamecrafters' Guild » Blog Archive » Betrayal in D&D http://www.rpgmusings.com/2010/06/opportunity-actions-campaign-workshop-betrayal/comment-page-1/#comment-187 Gamecrafters' Guild » Blog Archive » Betrayal in D&D Tue, 22 Jun 2010 16:24:11 +0000 http://www.rpgmusings.com/?p=598#comment-187 [...] a post over at RPG Musings about using betrayal as a major plot device in a D&D [...] [...] a post over at RPG Musings about using betrayal as a major plot device in a D&D [...]

]]> By: Brian Engard http://www.rpgmusings.com/2010/06/opportunity-actions-campaign-workshop-betrayal/comment-page-1/#comment-186 Brian Engard Tue, 22 Jun 2010 16:21:21 +0000 http://www.rpgmusings.com/?p=598#comment-186 Betrayal is often used as a hook in fiction, and it works well there because the author has total control over the characters involved, and the only one being surprised is the reader. In D&D, though, you have to tread very carefully if you're going to use betrayal. The problem with betrayal in D&D is that, if handled incorrectly, the players might feel betrayed or hoodwinked by you, the DM, and that's never good. Even if handled correctly, it may have the desired effect in the short term, but the long-term ramifications are going to be that the players will be far less likely to trust anyone, PC or NPC, which can have a number of negative effects on the campaign. First, you're probably not going to be able to use betrayal as a hook again for quite some time. Fool me once, et cetera. Second, if the PCs are constantly second-guessing each other, it may occasionally lead to great role-playing scenes, but more often than not it's probably just going to bog down the game and slow things down. Third, if the players are unlikely to trust any of the important NPCs you introduce for fear that they'll be betrayed, you're going to have a really hard time getting them to become attached to or invested in any of your NPCs, which can make it hard to motivate them to go on any of your adventures. This, I think, is the biggest issue. To mitigate some of this, I'd be inclined to be upfront with the players about the possibility of betrayal. When they're write up their dark secrets, tell them that these secrets might lead to one of the PCs betraying the others. Tell them that this might lead to one of their characters becoming a major campaign villain. This will solve two problems. First, it'll soften the blow of the betrayal a little bit, but maintain the surprise to a degree. The players will likely take the betrayal in the spirit in which it's intended (as an interesting plot device), rather than feeling hoodwinked and betrayed themselves. Second, it'll prepare them for the idea that their characters might leave the story early and become a villain, prompting them to play a new one for a while. After all, if you've spent ten or fifteen levels developing and growing attached to a character, and the DM comes to you and tells you he'd like to make that character a villain, how are you going to feel if you didn't see that coming? Now, I'll be the first to admit that this technique isn't going to solve all the problems inherent in using betrayal as a major plot device. For this reason, I try to use betrayal extremely sparingly, I try to restrict it to the NPCs, and I try to drop a hint or two, so that the players at least have a chance of figuring it out, and so that it's not such a "gotcha" moment. Betrayal is often used as a hook in fiction, and it works well there because the author has total control over the characters involved, and the only one being surprised is the reader. In D&D, though, you have to tread very carefully if you’re going to use betrayal. The problem with betrayal in D&D is that, if handled incorrectly, the players might feel betrayed or hoodwinked by you, the DM, and that’s never good. Even if handled correctly, it may have the desired effect in the short term, but the long-term ramifications are going to be that the players will be far less likely to trust anyone, PC or NPC, which can have a number of negative effects on the campaign.

First, you’re probably not going to be able to use betrayal as a hook again for quite some time. Fool me once, et cetera. Second, if the PCs are constantly second-guessing each other, it may occasionally lead to great role-playing scenes, but more often than not it’s probably just going to bog down the game and slow things down. Third, if the players are unlikely to trust any of the important NPCs you introduce for fear that they’ll be betrayed, you’re going to have a really hard time getting them to become attached to or invested in any of your NPCs, which can make it hard to motivate them to go on any of your adventures. This, I think, is the biggest issue.

To mitigate some of this, I’d be inclined to be upfront with the players about the possibility of betrayal. When they’re write up their dark secrets, tell them that these secrets might lead to one of the PCs betraying the others. Tell them that this might lead to one of their characters becoming a major campaign villain. This will solve two problems. First, it’ll soften the blow of the betrayal a little bit, but maintain the surprise to a degree. The players will likely take the betrayal in the spirit in which it’s intended (as an interesting plot device), rather than feeling hoodwinked and betrayed themselves. Second, it’ll prepare them for the idea that their characters might leave the story early and become a villain, prompting them to play a new one for a while. After all, if you’ve spent ten or fifteen levels developing and growing attached to a character, and the DM comes to you and tells you he’d like to make that character a villain, how are you going to feel if you didn’t see that coming?

Now, I’ll be the first to admit that this technique isn’t going to solve all the problems inherent in using betrayal as a major plot device. For this reason, I try to use betrayal extremely sparingly, I try to restrict it to the NPCs, and I try to drop a hint or two, so that the players at least have a chance of figuring it out, and so that it’s not such a “gotcha” moment.

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